Blood Prince Council Discussion

[Shadowwolf]

Info on the fight is here: http://wiki.twilightonalex.com/Blood_Prince_Council

Lets start some discussion on how to improve, make problem areas run smoother, etc. Have at it guys, brainstorming!

[Docsamson]

What seems to me to be one of the biggest problem areas on this encounter is the Empowered Shock Vortex, which requires the entire raid to spread out.  One easy way to help alleviate this is for casters/healers to remain spread out at maximum range of the boss at all times when possible.  Max caster range is 36 yards, healer range is 40.  Casters can easily be out of range of each other and healers at all times.  The range on the Shock Vortex is 10 yards for minimum damage.  This allows the tank to remain in place, and melee to scatter in a circle around the boss and never hit the ranged.  The goal is to split the difference between yourself and the ranged, then stop.

The other big thing is positioning on the Shadow boss.  The tank for him needs to be constantly running around gathering orbs, and having everyone spread helps a lot during the Shock Vortex phase.  Ideally, the Valanar and Taldaram tanks only move to avoid a Shock Zone on the boss, while the Keleseth tank is free to roam with the boss.  This will also help generate "safe zones" for the Keleseth tank to gain aggro without fear of an Empowered Shock Vortex knocking them away from healers.

[Deadlymijo]

   thats basically what it seemed like the empowered was dropping alot of us down in health then before got heals bombs landing killing us, so that does sound as a good point to stay as far as possible casters and healers spread out so when melee scatters we dont run into you

[fiere redfern]

To help with mobility, it'd be wise to keep marks up on the three tanks, with something particularly visible on the orb-tank. It'd help keep the raid more situationally aware of where their tanks are, but especially in the case of the orb tank, keeping a mark up on 'em will help their healer search them out if they get knocked silly by an empowered shock vortex. Yeah, the floaty balls of magic are kind of a big clue, but every little bit helps.

[Air]

I think next time I tank Keleseth, Ill try just planting myself in a corner somewheres and tank him there.  Grabbing any orbs close to me I can.  Than having one or two people scuttling orbs to me and pulling em off those people.  Supposedly not all aoe effects these orbs, just certain kinds.  Here's a list of em:


Misery   Frost Fever   Curse of Agony   Judgement of Light
Flame Shock   Shadow Mastery   Mind Flay   Corruption
Holy Vengeance   Vindication   Vampiric Touch   Mangle (Cat)
Devouring Plague   Explosive Shot       


Here's all the damage sources vs. the nuclei:


Arcane Barrage   Arcane Missiles   Auto Shot   Chain Lightning   Cleave
Corruption   Curse of Agony   Death Coil   Devouring Plague   Explosive Shot
Fire Blast   Flame Shock   Frost Fever   Heart Strike   Holy Vengeance
Icy Touch   Improved Devouring Plague   Judgement   Lava Burst   Mangle (Cat)
Melee   Mind Flay   Pillar of Flame   Quick Shot   Rune Strike
Shadow Bolt   Shoot   Steady Shot   Vampiric Touch

[Docsamson]

I think next time I tank Keleseth, Ill try just planting myself in a corner somewheres and tank him there.  Grabbing any orbs close to me I can.  Than having one or two people scuttling orbs to me and pulling em off those people.  Supposedly not all aoe effects these orbs, just certain kinds.  Here's a list of em:


Misery   Frost Fever   Curse of Agony   Judgement of Light
Flame Shock   Shadow Mastery   Mind Flay   Corruption
Holy Vengeance   Vindication   Vampiric Touch   Mangle (Cat)
Devouring Plague   Explosive Shot       


Here's all the damage sources vs. the nuclei:


Arcane Barrage   Arcane Missiles   Auto Shot   Chain Lightning   Cleave
Corruption   Curse of Agony   Death Coil   Devouring Plague   Explosive Shot
Fire Blast   Flame Shock   Frost Fever   Heart Strike   Holy Vengeance
Icy Touch   Improved Devouring Plague   Judgement   Lava Burst   Mangle (Cat)
Melee   Mind Flay   Pillar of Flame   Quick Shot   Rune Strike
Shadow Bolt   Shoot   Steady Shot   Vampiric Touch

From what I can tell, all AoE affects the orbs if they're within range.  I use Rank1 SW:P to pull them, and each tick puts me on top of their threat list.  They "aggro" someone based on who dealt damage to them last, so whatever hit them last is going to stick them to a person.  Now, before they're stuck, they can prox/healer aggro, but once they're nabbed, they will remain on you until someone else hits them.  Having someone scuttle orbs is probably a good idea, if we ever plan on doing hardmode in the future at least to get used to, as Keleseth/the Orbs put a reverse-Chains of Ice style effect on you, that increases your snare as you move.

[Darkstar]

Well i also noticed last night that my hand of reckoning would also grab the orbs and not damage them at all, just a thought since i pulled some orbs over to air a few times

[Docsamson]

Okay, since I'm obviously not on every single run, and we should pretty much have all our caster DPS have an understanding of how to do it, Keleseth tanking!

Step 1: Aggro Keleseth.  Ideally, you should aggro him with either a large nuke spell or a DoT with a large nuke.  DoT classes are much better for tanking Keleseth, but anyone can do it.
Step 2: Acquire orbs.  These are the Dark Nuclei you see floating around the room.  You don't want to damage them too much, you just need to give them a little tap.  I use Rank1 SW:P.  It costs the same as max-rank, but deals about 1/20th the damage, leaving nuclei up longer.  For the first part of the fight, your focus needs to be on gathering orbs.  You will get a minimum of 4 by the first Empower.  If Keleseth gets the Empower, and you don't have 4 orbs on you (meaning 4 Shadow Resonance buffs) you are going to die horribly.  A downranked DoT is ideal for these, as they aggro the person who last dealt damage to them.  Therefore, if you throw your DoT on them, and someone else accidently hits them with a single attack, they'll come right back to you when your DoT ticks again.  Once you have a comfortable amount of orbs on you, you can build some threat on the boss.  Because of the way this has to be tanked, it is not your job to make sure DPS doesn't pull aggro, it's their job.  Your only job is to acquire orbs and keep Keleseth off the healers.  Even if DPS can never touch the boss, if you survive through every empower you did your job.
Step 3:  Continue acquiring orbs, hitting the boss for threat, dodging Shock Zones, kiting Flame Spheres, and avoiding the Empower.  Mind your mana.  Don't use aggro drops.

Ideally, you want to try to stick around a "zone".  I tend to stick towards the left side of the arena, but it changes based on what is going on.  If a Kinetic Orb starts falling near you, MOVE.  The person juggling them will need to be uninterrupted, meaning don't stand near them during Empowered Shock Vortex.  Watch your raid warnings and move away if you get a Shock Vortex on you, but make sure you don't lock yourself off from your healer.  Hugging the walls helps, as it means the vortex will drop by a wall, so it's more easily avoided while moving.  Additionally, keep yourself away from the DPS on another boss.  A badly timed target swap with Keleseth getting empowered while you run through a cloud of AoE will get you killed and wipe the raid.

The final thing is to use non-empowered phases to gather orbs.  Once he's empowered, your mobility becomes limited due to your healer needing to stand still and heal you, thanks to the amount of damage coming in.  During an empower, I average 8-12k hits every 2.5 seconds.  This means you basically need to stop moving, unless your orbs are running out.  Never drop below 4 orbs during an empower.

For healers, he casts his Shadow Bolt every 2.5 seconds throughout the fight, even while moving.  Without empowered, it hits for 15k base, so 13k through non-orb damage reduction/shadow prot.  Be prepared at the beginning of the fight for a large amount of incoming damage.  once the orbs stack up, this reduces to a much more manageable amount.  When empowered, the Shadow Bolts smack you for 60k+ before orb reduction.  This comes out to about 8-12k after orbs/shadow prot/damage reduction.  If you've got paladins, this can be a good time to sac the orb tank.   Alternatively, Aura Master Shadow Res aura for a decent reduction.  Priests could in theory pop GS, but it's not so much damage that it's necessary.  Ideally, you should be able to do this entire fight without using a single tank/healer CD.  Just make sure the Keleseth tank is pre-hotted/shielded/ProM'd/ES/whatever, with another cast waiting, as he can cast a Shadowbolt instantly on aggro, with a second one 2.5s later.

[Zario]

I've only been on two attempts, but juggling the white orbs seems to become more of a priority than spreading out from the shock vortex.   If an orb spawns across the room that I need to run to, I couldn't necessarily focus on avoiding everyone and still get to the orb in time.

Anyone know if the raid needs to stay away from hunter pets?  Since the pet can be sent to take care of 1 orb, and stay there until is despawns, it may be ok for a raid member to stand with the pet if the shock ignores the pet or doesn't amplify the effect in any way,

[JohnnieRat]

don't hunter pet's have a ridiculous amount of damage mitigation vs AoE spells.... which shock vortex surely counts as?

[Grendeel]

Orbs spawning across the room when we are on one  side and far away certainly is an issue.  Heres what i did when assigned to it on 10 man.

1.  Asked the tank on Valanaar to tank him closer to the stage.
2.  Send my pet (imp) after the first orb
3.  Hang out in the middle of the room and go after the 2nd orb that spawns
4.  Have my pet focused and whenever that orb despawned, i sent him after the one I was on
5.  Dont wait for the pet to get there. Move to the centre of the room and hang out til the next orb spawns.
6.  Go after the newly spawned orb

Rinse and repeat

***Note***

Even though the pet has insane aoe mitigation, it still takes damage from some source.  I had to health funnel my imp at least once every attempt.  A dead pet prolly will wipe the raid

Also, since the person doing this isnt really contributing to the dps on the boss, it would be ideal to throw on any stam gear u may have (pvp gear works great).  For me, this effectively removed any chance of being one shotted by an empowered fire ball (it happened the first attempt i did )

For warlocks, the voidwalker doesnt attack fast enough to keep the orbs in the air.  So dont use it here.