Sarth - 3D

[Tony]

Just watched a youtube video on MMO-Champion's front page. Apparently, these people just ran in and started killing Sarth and continued on him until he was dead, only one tank, one healer, and the rest dps. They downed him in 76 seconds. After he was dead, they wiped. However, they got the title, achievement, and loot. I think this is something we should try before they patch it.

[Nasanna]

If you look at their group composition, they had 1 tank, 1 healer, and all dps were over 4.6k dps, and their top dps at 6.2k.

We would also have to stack the group, the article mentions:

Obviously it won't work with most of the raid composition and you will need a lot of DPS to achieve such a fast kill, but it could be an interesting way to farm the encounter for everyone when most of the players are geared with Ulduar items ...

It is a cool idea but I really doubt that we are up for it now. Here is a link to the article: http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=47540.0

[Tony]

With all of the issues we've had with +1 and +2, it might be worth a shot on a 25 man. We have people that can do 4k dps. J-Rat, from what I can tell, can do 5k+ in a drunken stupor. What really sparked my interest is that they are heavy on melee.

I believe...

[TheGeneral451]

with a short fight the dps can be up by 500+ because you are just burning all cds.  Heroism, cds, and all out attacks.  THe problem it seems like would be if anyone gets hit with the flame wall, then the healer would have to rip off big heals and keep the tank up.

[Docsamson]

This was done by players that were all BIS geared.  When Heroism was popped, they would have (probably) chained it with a [item]40211[/item], while blowing all cooldowns during it.  The reason they are melee heavy (rogue/war/war/war/war/DK/DK/druid) is because those classes get a gigantic DPS boost from Heroism.  The DKs were Blood and Frost, to prevent overlapping diseases.  Another big thing to note is that this group is passively AoE-heavy, allowing them to kill the whelps from Tenebron when they spawn, as well as killing any Lava Blazes (I haven't watched the video, but presumably they'd kill them passively with WW/Consecration alone).  All 4 warriors were Fury, but I have no idea what the rogue was (SnD, Hemo, and Evis were all being used).  The Shaman was specially geared and glyphed for LHW/HW spam to amplify single-target throughput.  This is, more or less, the necessary group comp.  It could probably be done with more rogues, but then you lose the AoE potential against whelps from WW, requiring your solo tank to pick up more of them.  The warriors/DKs were also good self-healers, which was one of the big reasons for bringing the druid as well (LotP crit healing component), and his ability to kite Tenebron away when he enrages at Sarth hitting 25% HP.

This is, honestly, a strategy equally as silly as VW tanking and Reflective Shield kills.  While it "trivializes" the fight, it also requires a degree of raid stacking that prevents most people from ever being able to do it.

[Shadowwolf]

The gear level was all Ulduar stuff on them. They did it as a gag to see. While I'd be all for giving it a whirl come 3.1 once we get people in T8 and whatnot if it hasnt been patched by then, its definitely not something doable on the regular game just yet by anyone. We would have to raid stack and whatnot so fiercely and even then it would be questionable. Some of the people on that run were doing 6 and 7k DPS, our best on fights where we have buffs from bosses like Thaddius is when we see DPS rates that high, so I dont see it.

3 Drakes will come, and the title isnt going anywhere with 3.1, so I wouldnt fret. Itll come, its just going to take us a little longer because we dont raid stack like most raid guilds typically do for the achievement. We were really close to having 2 just a few weeks ago when we had the right raid composition for it, once we get more practice at it, itll come.

[Tony]

So is it really that bad to have heavy melee? I mean, I love doing dps, but if I can better serve the guild by being ranged dps, I have no problems.

I will always have a better experience doing dps, so that is what I do.

I have NO problem working on my hunter to help out more.

Let me know, please!

As far as the 3-d thing goes, yea, its a pipe dream.... /sigh.... Not that I want LEWT or a title, but the satisfaction of saying that we did it. I have no problem waiting for the opportune time for it though 

[fiere redfern]

Twilight will always be about playing what makes you happy - we'll never force you into playing a certain toon. Really the only reason why it can be considered "bad" to be heavy on melee is because so many fights (Sarth+drakes included) are not at all melee-friendly. It's a whole helluva lot easier for a ranged dps to pick off adds or shift for flame waves than it is for a melee who may be focused on Sarth and not see the flame wave coming at them. Big dragon wings are big, and a pita to see through. >.<

[Shadowwolf]

The Blizzard devs are notorious for making most boss fights melee dps unfriendly. Almost all the bosses in BC raids were melee unfriendly and more favorable for ranged, I think it wasnt till BT where melee DPS got a few fights that were friendly for melee and not ranged.

On OS with drakes, its really really REALLY unfriendly for melee because of the void zones, the need for AOE on adds, and the lava waves which to move for the waves detracts from DPS time since you have to move clear while ranged can move clear and still DPS.

Even on KT in Naxx you can see it, one person gets ice blocked and all the melee get it which is dumb because Chain Heal, Circle of Healing and Wild Growth, etc only effect 6 and 5 targets, so that means its a RNG for whos going to not get a heal and die.

The majority of hard core raid guilds stack more range DPS than melee, and if Im not mistaken, on the guilds on our server who did that Heroic: Glory of the Raider, aside from tanks they brought 1 or 2 melee DPS, the rest was ranged.

You play what you want to play and whats most enjoyable and we work it out in the end. Doing that is what makes us unique and I will boldly say "better" in many ways than other guilds because instead of taking the easy way out to do things, we just try and overcome them regardless and so far we havent failed. It may take us a little longer to accomplish something because of that reason, but in the process I believe everyone becomes a more solid player because we arent handed a win easily and have to work for it. In many ways we carry more respect on and off the server than guilds like Invictus do for the simple fact that most people only show them respect because they beat content quickly and before everyone else since they dedicate the time to do that, we beat content our way and in most situations in ways contrary to popular suggestion which shows we have skill. Thats not to say that everyone in raiding guilds like Invictus doesnt have play skill, its just a lot easier to win an encounter when you narrow down all the variables and go in with as much in your favor as possible beforehand then the way we do it which is "play for the moment and for the fun". We still do our homework on fights beforehand to not walk in unprepared, but more often than not we have to adjust or re-develop tactics to work for ourselves because we do things differently. Its almost like we have to re-learn encounters before we can complete them because the standards of practice that work for most everyone else as is, dont work for us as is.

[Tony]

Thanks for your input everyone. I suppose, one day,  we will look back at Sarth 3-D as we do with the Jenkins title. The thrill of wanting to get it is there because it is something very hard to get right now. A year or so from now, it will be something very easy to get.

It's not about the destination, it's about the journey. Don't stop believing!

[fiere redfern]

It's not about the destination, it's about the journey. Don't stop believing!

I wasn't aware I'd stepped into a Disney movie... /waits for the animals to start singing

[Belandand]

hold on to that fe-I-fe-I-lin'. Streetlight..peee-puuuuuuuuulllllllllll.

[Shadowwolf]

Just a small town girl
Living in a lonely world
She took the midnight train going anywhere
Just a city boy
Born and raised in South Detroit
He took the midnight train going anywhere

Seriously tho, itll still be hard even with Ulduar gear. Its all about proper coordination and attentiveness.

[un4]

That song...

I hate you so much right now, Shadow.

[JohnnieRat]

better than having Creed (any song of theirs) stuck in your head